Written by TheBigN
This is sort of a continuation from my last installment in this category from my experience at the D.C. Sakura Matsuri. As you recall, I immediately criticized in my mind the actions of some participants during a cosplay contest for what I thought was no good reason. And I had mentioned that at the time I was thinking that as anime fans, we represent anime culture to the rest of “society” (a fun concept to be sure). So the “logical” conclusion I had was that because these cosplayers weren’t acting “normal” in regards to society, moral scruples, or whatever kinds of standards most of us agree abide by, they were demonstrating to people that anime culture isn’t normal. Therefore anime would not be perceived as normal and “those” fans end up making it harder for the medium to have “mainstream acceptance”, whatever the hell that is. Not the best train of thought there, as you can see, and I’m still a little ashamed at myself for that unfounded rationale.
Yet when I think about it, thinking about the worst possible scenario as the most likely option seems to be common from what I’ve seen from fellow anime fans. The example I listed seems to be stated a lot, where fans that are a bit overzealous compared to “everyone else” tend to be singled out in this manner. But other situations abound that follow this trend. Fansubs being the main reason why the anime industry is apparently going down the tubes, not to mention the closing down of anime distribution companies like Geneon USA making a big contribution as well. Shows like Kanokon or Kodomo no Jikan, not even mentioning hentai (or the “Dark Side” of anime) possibly being used as “Exhibit A”s on why anime isn’t a good thing. The slippery slope argument tends to be used in different ways by many different people including myself, as if anime fans are a gloom and doom prophesying bunch.
I do wonder why many of us seem to believe that things will go to hell in a hand-basket so quickly with anime. One reason seems to feed back into that desire I mentioned earlier of wanting the medium to be acknowledged as something that’s alright to indulge in from the mainstream. That probably goes into the whole “Anime is from Japan = different” situation making it harder for that acceptance to occur, but I can’t claim to know if that has any bearing on this desire at all. I also wouldn’t say that it’s a struggle to get a broad approval for anime outside of its fandom, as I know of others that don’t mind remaining in the niche we’re currently in. But there’s a definite effort to show off the best that we feel can be offered to everyone, which I feel is a natural response to demonstrating what you like.
I get the impression from blogs, forums, IRC and the like that some fans feel like if we’ve managed to make a connection to the general public and present a positive image of anime at all, that connection is flimsy at best. I can see a strong worry, and I have that worry myself, that the least “desirable” aspects of anime will destroy how things have been built up, making the situation even worse than before. Or there isn’t enough anime out there that can reach a mainstream audience, despite the efforts of things like Adult Swim out there, and that also makes the relationship weaker. Or it could be something else entirely, and the combination of these and other factors are what lead to a less than optimal result. From that, we might get some of the negativity and a little desperation that I see in the fan culture today, but it’s only one example and I’m sure others can provide better explanations for that sort of thing.
One thing I do know is that it leads to a lot of what I consider to be irrational and misguided anger and worry on other elements of the fan culture. There seems to be a lot of the “this is why we can’t have nice things/you’re ruining stuff for us” irritation taken out on things like cosplayers acting silly, or on shows that have fanservice for the sake of fanservice, for example. And the hubbub over things like the moe boom (which seems to apparently be slowing down), or acting as if these “problems” don’t exist feel more overblown than they should be a lot of the time. Are things like that really ruining things for the rest of us, and how would they be doing that? Sure, those things can be embarrassing to us, but I feel like we’re using them as scapegoats as there the most visible parts of what we don’t like about anime and the culture, especially when we probably aren’t even going to deal with those things (watching the shows in question, directly talking to the transgressors, etc.). We place the blame on them for the sake of pointing fingers, and maybe to externalize our palpable fears and worries about everything that we enjoy crashing down in an instant. Should things really be that SERIOUS BUSINESS? Is bashing stuff that we aren’t going to bother with otherwise the right thing to do? Are we really that insecure about how strong anime is? I’d like to hope not.
Granted, I’m just a blogger standing on a soapbox that probably doesn’t need to be there, I’m probably being hypocritical by complaining about the complainers without doing anything about it, and I’m probably not the best person to be talking about it. But those thoughts have been something that’s been bothering me for a bit, and it’s always good to get what ails you off of your shoulder, lest that dirt on your shoulder becomes an unnecessary chip. And I do think that we all need to cool off every once in a while, less we might end up causing the downfall of anime ourselves. And if that isn’t a poor slippery slope argument waiting to happen, I don’t know what is. 
TheBigN
nomadotto
dm00
Well, overzealous fans have always been a terrible thing. I believe in not forcing your opinions upon others, but some of these people really just don’t get the point. Over here in Malaysia, we do get idiots like this too. Most notably during the annual Bon Odori celebrations where there are always cases of idiots coming in Naruto garb when the festival is all about honoring the dead.
Something I find quite relevent: http://kurogane.animeblogger.net/2007/08/05/i-like-anime-and-im-proud-of-it/
YES. Ironically I just made a post on a similar subject.
Hey, anime is mainstream here what. There are more people in Singapore our age who have seen anime than those who haven’t. Too bad the US of A is made up of lame people like Sasuke2314 and Narutoizbest24.
Kurogane: At the same time, I shouldn’t condone calling them out as vehemently as some people are. Notice that I don’t call them idiots, morons, and the like
Hinano: Truth be told, I read the post, and though I understand how you feel based on how the cosplayers were acting at the festival (this is the right post, right? :P), I can’t really agree with that statement. As I’ve said in the post, I feel that sort of thinking doesn’t help things, and that I think they aren’t “ruining” things as much as we want them to be. So it will make us feel better, which is stupid.
tj han: Should have clarified then.
But I still see many people pessimistic at anime culture overall.
I think it is really a self fulfilling prophesy by fans, corporations and the general public. If you think something will be going down, the chances of it occurring because you believe and act unconsciously toward this goal is more likely.
The worst thing is most of these people who complain, really hope for anime to be mainstream. However, they do not think it will truly succeed, and their actions reflect that. There is a difference I guess from whiners and makers.
Think of it this way. If a corporation keeps telling you that you are at fault and that they are going down, will you think that they will defeat the odds and stay up. Most will just assume they will go down after a while. Negative sentiments is the worst thing that can ever happen to any industry, fan group or organization.
Time for a positive spin on things, anyone?
I don’t want anime to be normal or mainstream. I want it to be a sordid den of pedophilia, fetishes, and moe fan service. Because that’s what I LIKE about anime.
Oh, also, you’ll never see lolicons and moetaku being embarassing in public like the Narutards do. That’s because we don’t want attention, we just want to enjoy our hobbies safely in private. When you see a a conservatively dressed college age guy with glasses and a plaid button-up shirt, that’s what a lolicon or moe fan looks like. Lolicon and moe fans are far more orderly, quiet, and polite than those cosplaying shounen-shit or yaoi fans.
Impz: Which is why you should watch Manabi.
Anon: The negativity doesn’t even have to stem from wanting anime to go mainstream. It’s just being unnecessarily negative that’s the problem.
And somehow I’m thinking that if you just ditch the plaid shirt, magical things will start to happen.
As long as anime is good, nothing else matters to me.
lol, you stole that Tamaki pic. I’m glad that I don’t care about any of that stuff and don’t view it as hurting anime… then again, its probably because i am the biggest embarrassment to anime fandom around XD
While I don’t agree with their taste, it’s actually true. I’d rather go to a con filled with these people than the yaoi fangirls because at least I could enjoy it without having to fear that some tub or lard will launch itself at me because they were roughousing each other about whether Sasuke should buttsecks Naruto or Itachi
loL @ moé fans being orderly.
i’ve seen some really messed up things in my life, and I can only say this; Even the moé fans are fucked up. If anything, the worst of them are horrible dictators. The best of them just happen to be no better than your average Japanese.
I generally suppress my power levels in public, even among other anime otakus. Things only get out of hand when I put on my Gurren Lagann shirt P:
All I can say is that since you have Tamaki in it, this post OWNS!!!
The nail that sticks out and all that…we’re not so different sometimes.
Oh, yes. I can see why you said what you did on IRC earlier.
From how I see it with my armchair psychoanalysis, the only reason I can come up with as to why we have this kneejerk reaction is how we view our otaku life — are we constantly living in this fear of being “found out” by our real life friends, and then associated with these crazy people in the fandom as a result?
I can safely say that I’d be fine with it, all things considered; I wouldn’t be any less passionate of this hobby even if it made it into the news and was vilified as a result, because why should other people dictate my enjoyment of this medium? Other, more insecure fans may be externalising their fears through this slippery slope, and that might be why they say the things they do.
>drmchsr0
dictators? like the S.S. armband/Banana republic kind?
;_;
Caitlin: But does that really solve anything other than you yourself remaining as you are? Not really in my opinion.
Owen: Our perspectives on ourselves as anime fans could also be a possible reason for this behavior. The “I’m not like them” approach naturally flows from that. Which is also disappointing.
Baka-Raptor: That might be one of the better ways to go about it, based on what I’m seeing. :/
Digitalboy: I wouldn’t necessarily condone how excessive you can get sometimes, but it’s good that you can keep your head up.
Hinano, Drm and others: Ummm, life experiences dictate how we view things obviously. But sometimes it’s good to take a step back and look at the big picture. Or try to look at the situation at a different way (why you feel the way you do, etc.).
Anonymous:
Loli and Moe fans wear glasses and button up shirts? That’s my school uniform, not to mention my taste in formal attire. But I’m not a Loli fan, and I am not entirely familiar with how Moe works other than an attraction to Anime characters, which I’ve tried to distance myself from ever since I had just gotten over, a year ago, the fact that Sakaki from Azumanga Daioh can’t love me back and never will.
But I suppose if I have at least at some stage in my life had a crush on an Anime character I would have some Moe tendencies, or is there some very distinct difference I’m not aware of that would make me uncomfortable?
Meh, everybody is so uptight with sexuality. I feel we can accept it, be familiar, enjoy, etc without degrading into a purely hedonistic society, but that’s just me.
Anyway, I think the media culture we have is standard. I could care less what my friends think about media from Japan, because we still connect on the other major media. On top of how we are “seen” in society, or represented, is a layer of generalization. I’ll share my time with those who can see beyond Narutardogmaism, whether they like or dislike a media. Perhaps this cuts a large piece of population pie, but I’m only a single unit, and there’s a limit to how many people one can actively involve in life.
That’s my take ^^ mmm, hmmm, hedonism
Ryan A >
My problem is not what I think about sexuality in Anime. It is what my parents will think of what I think about sexuality in Anime.
I’m not prudish normally, but incredibly shy of what people think of what I watch. I don’t watch Hentai, but I am wary of watching anything that might set off alarm bells or be interpreted the wrong way when my parents are home/awake.
I was *this* close to being caught watching Love Hina on my laptop just when the lead guy had his face in a character’s ample bosom. Ever since I’ve been very careful. (And I reckon Love Hina is a terrible show anyway, there’s a fine line between stupid and clever, to use the words of Spinal Tap)
I totally can’t be assed to read through all this right now (I STILL LU BB DON’T WORRY I AM JUST SICK RIGHT NOW AND DO NOT FEEL LIKE IT) but seriously, chill out. Just enjoy what you like and as long as it’s not something that’s going to get you arrested, don’t worry about how anime looks to everyone else. :U
PS: AND YEAH A LOT OF ANIMETARDS ARE INSECURE. WELCOME TO THE WORLD OF THE OTAKU.
Ryan A:
I guess that what many want to see is more of a “tolerance/acceptance” of anime. But I do wonder how much are we actually doing to help promote that, if we’re doing anything at about that at all instead of just complaining. :/
Jacob Martin:
That’s one of the things that I think we as anime fans are a bit too toabout this sort of thing, the overanxiousness makes sense. It’s a problem, and it gets worse when people instantly go to the worst case scenario about it though. What’s the worst that could happen if your parent’s find out and what’s the likelyhood of that possibility coming into play should the situation come into play, for example. I guess I want people to think about it a little bit more.
Marmot: I don’t think we need to totally chill out (Like, Toooootally), but I do agree that we all need to calm down somewhat. :3
@Jacob:
Actually, I *saw* a Love Hina scene like that (involving groping? I couldn’t tell what with all the onsen steam) on my old roommate’s laptop. He had awful taste in anime though, and I for sure wasn’t “initiated” into its realm yet either. (Then again, I’m really not an Akamatsu fan in any sense of the word XD)…